Two of Australia's "top relationship experts" were on Today this morning to promote Channel 9's new show, Married At First Sight, and things got awkward.
The show follows four heterosexual couples who have been paired together based on a psychological assessment. The couples are then sent by the show's producers to get hitched, despite having never met before.
Plenty of people are mad at the show, saying it trivialises marriage while same-sex couples still can't get married in Australia.
Almost 21,000 people have signed a petition calling on the show to be axed.
The experts, Dr John Aiken and Dr Sabina Read, seemed to be expecting a pretty soft interview, but Karl and Lisa were having none of it.
Just look at Dr John's face when Karl basically told him he was trivialising marriage.
Karl and Lisa also questioned whether the contestants were only in it to become famous and pointed out that they're not actually getting legally married. (it's only a "commitment ceremony")
Karl said the show is actually more like speed dating than a wedding, which made Dr John do this.
When asked how she responds to the controversy, Dr Read defended the show.
"Initially when I was asked to do the show and I thought they were legally binding marriages I said no."
"But for me, relationships are so important and we see so many hurdles that people experience in relationships. What would it be like if we could be more purposeful and more aware [in relationships?]"
"We talk about chemistry - about meeting someone across the smoky dance floor - but there's no guarantee when you have all the chemistry, that chemistry will keep a relationship together five, 10, 15 years down the track."
Mercifully, the interview ended with Karl saying he would watch the show because it made him angry. Which made the experts do this.
In an earlier statement to BuzzFeed News, Channel 9 defended the show.
"In order to comply with the Australian Marriage Act (1961) which requires one month and one day notification, a marriage in law was not conducted," they said.
"Each participant embarked on a commitment ceremony with a wedding celebrant with all due intention to commit fully to this union for the duration of the experiment. At the end of the experiment they are given the option to continue with the relationship or go their separate ways."